Based on what Bo says about the previous referendum and what Barefoot says about Catholic teaching still being followed by many if not most people, I'm wondering how much support there is for this repeal, and what the early indications are as to the result, percentage and demographic-wise; anyone got any idea?
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Originally posted by KatieMorag View PostBut in the medical profession there's probably more younger people, who might not feel the same.
I know over here it used to be the case that Catholics could opt out of performing abortions - not sure if that's still the case. So they might put something similar in place in Ireland.
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Originally posted by KatieMorag View PostBut in the medical profession there's probably more younger people, who might not feel the same.
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Originally posted by KatieMorag View PostI don't really understand your point about the loss to society - putting aside the moral arguments, surely the benefits to society - financial, social, etc., and to the women concerned - would be greater than the disadvantages? And unwanted pregnancies are already prevented through contraception anyway - in purely practical terms, and again leaving aside the moral arguments, early abortion would just be an extension of family planning, which i would say anyone with an ounce of sense is in agreement with.....
Another consequences that I noticed is after a number of years where abortion is permitted in a country , the average citizen seems to be desensitised to it .
They seem aghast when they hear of the restrictions here , and Amnesty International and the UN have found against Ireland for infringing a so called human rights violation . How we got here as a society in such a short time ?
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Originally posted by bojangles View PostI mean all the children that would not be born if we bring in abortion . I cant look at it coldly and clinically and accept that because they were aborted for practical or economical reasons , that they never born in this world and therefore should not be recognised as a loss to mankind .
Another consequences that I noticed is after a number of years where abortion is permitted in a country , the average citizen seems to be desensitised to it .
They seem aghast when they hear of the restrictions here , and Amnesty International and the UN have found against Ireland for infringing a so called human rights violation . How we got here as a society in such a short time ?
I think the crux of the matter, and why it's such a difficult subject to talk about, is that people differ widely in their idea of when human life begins, and how lives should be prioritised: should an eight-week embryo, which isn't fully developed and isn't even aware of its existence, be given priority over a woman whose life is going to be affected in all sorts of ways should she continue with the pregnancy? Is "life" in this context purely an academic concept? I think this should be the starting point for any discussion on this subject because everybody has different views on what "life" actually means and those differences should be explored.
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I do not discuss this issue usually, have always been against abortion for me as a person, but I will never try to force my views on to anyone else, I would travel with friends if needed and respect their choice.
I need to see the wording of this referendum in order to make the correct choice.
I have no interest in how others feel as debating it will not alter how I feel.
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Originally posted by bigby View PostI do not discuss this issue usually, have always been against abortion for me as a person, but I will never try to force my views on to anyone else, I would travel with friends if needed and respect their choice.
I need to see the wording of this referendum in order to make the correct choice.
I have no interest in how others feel as debating it will not alter how I feel.
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Originally posted by KatieMorag View Postthat's 22 days after conception, ie at 5 weeks (dating pregnancy from the lmp.)
So very early on in the pregnancy.
I just read up on the 1967 Abortion Act in the UK. Abortion was allowed up until 28 weeks gestation. This was reduced to 24 weeks gestation in 1990.
Abortion on demand is not available in the UK....
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Originally posted by barefoot View PostYes around 6 weeks Katie.
I just read up on the 1967 Abortion Act in the UK. Abortion was allowed up until 28 weeks gestation. This was reduced to 24 weeks gestation in 1990.
Abortion on demand is not available in the UK....
Not sure of all the laws......l.have you got a link BF?
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Originally posted by KatieMorag View Postthat's 22 days after conception, ie at 5 weeks (dating pregnancy from the lmp.)
So very early on in the pregnancy.
I heard a well known Obstetrician from a London Hospital talking about the subject on Radio 4 years ago. He said that if a baby fights back very hard, he does not abort. I never thought about little embryos fighting for their life and I found his remark very disturbing. He had nothing against abortion itself, but felt it would be unethical to abort a baby that is fighting for his little life.
At the time of the last referendum on the subject, my son came home from school very distressed. Their religion teacher had brought in a video of a child being aborted. I don't know what they do now, but in those days they used a saline solution, and there was some other way to do it also. Sorry I cannot remember what it was, but the main point is that the child was being burned. Apparently it could not be performed painlessly. So the baby is not just being killed, but tortured. At all the debates, it is about the mother taking a decision re her own body, but what about the baby's body. Who stands up for him, when he has no voice.
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